Out of the Jungle of Old Habits of thought

It used to seem that my husband and I *could not be compatible* when we each had such different ways of thinking about parenting. But then we decided that our relationship was more important than our current difference of opinion, and chose to just keep loving each other, and in the meantime, talk through each disagreement that came up.
I have been struggling with something that I found hard to put into words, but I am going to give it a go because I am hoping to help myself process it faster for my kids' sake.
I am doing my best to stay in a *person to person* mindset with my kids, instead of that *parent to child* relationship. My husband is really throwing me off though, when he asks questions about why I make certain decisions, "where do I think the kids will end up after that particular decision I made,etc.." and he leads me off into the jungle of old habits of thinking, and I find it really hard to find my way back to the open field of freedom.
I think that maybe this morning, I've started to find my way there, and maybe I can mark the trail enough for him to at least *see* which way I went, even if he doesn't want to *go there* with me. It is, of course, his choice, because it IS his life. :)
Oftentimes, when I want to "give" the kids their freedom, he has a scenario in which this wouldn't be a good idea, and he thinks that this should *prove* to me that "giving" them THEIR freedom is not a good idea *all* the time. He thinks he is compromising with me, by "giving" them their freedom a LOT of the time.
A good comparison for me of "giving" freedom, would be one of prisoners in a halfway house situation. (and I don't know all the ins and outs of one of these places, I'm just guessing). They get to "have" their freedom for *most* of the day. They choose where to get a job, what time to get up, what color socks to wear, how many layers of clothing to wear (they decide based on their own comfort level), what they want to eat for breakfast, the mode of transportation they use to get to work, what they eat for lunch, what route they choose to drive to and from, they go to the bathroom when they have to, etc, etc...
My point is, they have *a lot* of freedom in comparison to people in a locked down prison situation. (My husband likes to compare how he gives such freedoms to our kids, like so many other parents don't.)
He said to me the other day, "Michelle, you HAVE the authority. You just CHOOSE to give it to the kids." I struggled with how to answer that. My gut feeling (YAY! I actually listen to those now!) was NO, they naturally HAVE autonomy, but lots of people believe that parents SHOULD have authority over them. But I wasn't as articulate as I feel I am about it now.

A lot of times, I have unarticulated thoughts in my head, and I find them articulated in verbal conversations with other people, in books, online, or, they just come out articulated in their own time from my own subconscious mind. This time it was in a post on a message board.
Someone made the point that we aren't "giving" our kids their freedom. It IS their inalienable human right. That resonated with my heart. Something inside me said, "Yes! That's what I think too! How can we be "giving" them something that is a human right they were born with?!" It felt, and feels, so wrong to me.
Which leads me back to the halfway house/locked down prison scenario. Either way, the prisoners are being GIVEN the right to make choices. In the locked down (very authoritative parent) scenario, the choices aren't many. In the halfway house scenario, the choices are SO much more. But they are both under a certain final authority... you can see where I am going with this.
And following my husbands' train of thought, he would be thinking, "Yes, I am under authority, too. I am under the 'have to provide for my family' authority, and the 'authority of God' "... I'm sure there are many other 'authorities' he puts himself under, giving him reason to want to put the kids under his authority, so that they aren't so shocked "when they grow up" at the levels of restraint put on them.... I think I'm getting into his head just the littlest bit now... He's a hard nut to crack sometimes. He certainly views the children's lives now as a preparation for the "real" world. I don't agree. I think they ARE in the REAL world NOW! They are learning what they need to learn for the place that they are in now.
We may find a lot of people who agree with us when we say that we think it'd be a "good experience" for them to go to school for a year. But what if the child does not think it's a good idea? How is it good for them then? Will they be ready, receptive, and open to the experience? I think not. I think they will be filtering the experience through their feeling of being "forced" to go for a year.
When they are ready, receptive, and open, they will learn. THAT'S when the experience is fully taken in. Not until then. When they are closed to an experience by feelings of sadness, fear, or anger, not much else gets in. Their heads are full of their own thoughts and emotions. Better to wait until they are open to a new experience. Then they will excitedly open themselves to new and positive things.
My way out of the jungle is beginning to come clear to me. Dare I follow my own path?!


"They learn cause and effect by making choices. It is
unavoidable. If they cut their hair short and they aren't happy with
the results, then they can file that away for the future. It doesn't
have to be labeled "good" or "bad" but just, "Hmm, maybe not so short
next time."

To themselves.

If they have someone telling them that they
made a mistake, then that can be damaging, IMO. They start to (maybe
only the sensitive ones, maybe only with repeated instances) feel like
they can't do anything right.

But if the parent gives them "freedom for
freedom's sake", then they are free to
experiment until they find something that makes them happy.

Freedom is connected to
happiness *and* learning, IMO. If it makes me tense and frustrated to
give them freedom with the goal of allowing them to learn, then maybe I can be more
relaxed and happy by giving them freedom just because that *should* be their inalienable human right.

Is it really molding? Or is it warping?

The way Savannah’s voice changed the other night, when speaking to me, caught me off gaurd. It changed as soon as she was “free” of my and g-ma’s expectations; because she was going to grandma’s house by herself for the night. She felt individual, not like “one of the kids”, and this changed her attitude. She sounded so much older and confident. Kind of like I heard her sound in the car when singing to High School Musical.
I want her to be able to feel that confident around me all the time. Or at least as much as she can. Sure, there may be times when she'll need babied. There are times when I need to be babied too...BUT, I don't want to feel evaluated, or babied all the time.
Wouldn’t I feel kind of held back or held down if someone I loved were always evaluating my mental growth, and trying to “help me grow” by constantly advising and admonishing me, or worse yet punishing me either with disapproval/disdain, or actual physical punishment when I made a mistake, calling it “doing wrong” even though I already knew what I did was wrong? I’d feel bad for the wrong but that would be quickly overlaid with the emotion of feeling ‘put down’ by the person ‘evaluating’ me…
I see that all the time in my relationship with my kids, but didn’t know how to fix it before, and still find it difficult to break those controlling, mistrusting habits.
I think that what I need to do is:

1. Stop evaluating them.

2. Let them grow at their own pace.

3. Trust that they have the inborn ability to grow and learn by watching.

I didn’t have to interfere AT ALL with their learning to walk and talk, and so many other things. I just stood by, watched it happen, and pick them up when they fell down and hurt themselves…. Hmmmm… sounds awfully familiar. I think that the universe is all spinning together in my life on this one. It sounds just like how I need to be allowed to be my own person without my surrogate parents constantly evaluating me, and letting me know where they think I stand in life, and with God.
I am actually really glad that I am going through all this other stuff because it is really timely to me understanding how to parent my kids by seeing that I am a person who needs my autonomy just like they do!
Giving someone their freedom is scarier and harder than trying to control them.

(which isn't REALLY sharing anyway)

I hope Scott doesn't mind my adding my own experience to his thoughts (they are below, please read after you read my thoughts)... This particular daily groove reminded me of the other night with my 3 year old (whom we have rarely told NO when it comes to what food she eats - she pretty much sets her own diet with a few suggestions -not commands- from my husband and I).
She had used some of her birthday money to purchase a Hershey bar. Just your run of the mill, plain chocolate Hershey bar. But I doubt she'd ever eaten one before, judging on her reaction. She took one bite, and enthusiasticaly said, "WOW! Mom, Dad, you HAVE to try this!!" It was so cute!
I know some other kids (probably because their diets have been hardset by their parents who were unaware of the selfishness that is promoted by such scarcity theory), who would not have been happy about sharing had they been asked... let alone be delighted for someone else to eat it. And no, it wasn't just the first bite she was excited about, and No, she did not hoard the rest. She continued to give some to her baby brother without a word from us, and shared it down to the last bite.
This to me, proves that children are naturally not selfish all of the time. It is a conditioning that we enforce to become more often in them through the selfishness we model. And we have inherited this from the modeling of our parents' and other people in society's selfishness. This may seem radical to some people. But observe your habits with your children. Do you hide "your" snacks, so that your kids cannot find them? Even if they never find out about that, how could your attitude possibly come off as a sharing one if your attitude is to hide food and not share it with them? How is it that we parents have a tendency to show this "do as I say, not as I do" attitude at times? Do we appreciate people with more experience or authority lording it over us like that??
Back to the subject of sharing which isn't really sharing anyway. In the above example my daughter was truly sharing. It came from her heart. There have been times when she has *not* wanted to share. If I force her to share, then she is only complying to my demands. She is NOT sharing. Which kind of *sharing* do I want to encourage?

THE DAILY GROOVE ~ by Scott Noelle
www.enjoyparenting.com/dailygroove

:: The Joy of Sharing ::

Imagine yourself back in the throes of puberty, and
you're madly in love with someone who doesn't yet
know how you feel...

You're at a park, enjoying an ice cream cone, when
your would-be lover walks by, sees you, and smiles!
You offer your beloved a bite of your ice cream, and
you're OVERJOYED when the offer is accepted!

Back to the present... Now imagine you're eating some
delicious strawberries. You only have two left, and
you intend to savor *both* of them. Then your child
sees the strawberries and says, "I want one!"

Are you as thrilled to share with your child as you
would be in the first scenario? If not, why the
difference? (Hint: love trumps scarcity.)

The way to raise kids who *enjoy* sharing is for you
to enjoy sharing with *them*. Frequently offer them
bites of your food, for example, and let them know
how good you feel when you're sharing.

When your child doesn't feel like sharing something
with a sibling or playmate, rather than forcing them
to share (which isn't REALLY sharing anyway), find something
that *you* can share joyfully.

As you consistently demonstrate *your* sharing ethic,
they will eventually discover the joy of sharing for
themselves.